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  #1  
Old 08-08-2017, 04:24 AM
marwil99 marwil99 is offline
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Default Steering wheel wobble

My steering wheel vibrates at 110kmh, as if the wheels are out of balance. Have had balanced 3 times. Wheels also been aligned. 20" wheels and A/T tyres.
Checked bushes, steering, brakes also.
Does pull slightly to the right on braking, but no judder. Any other suggestions apart from changing the wheels and tyres ?
2014 right hand drive Ranger.


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  #2  
Old 08-08-2017, 02:21 PM
cowboybilly9mile cowboybilly9mile is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

Could be a problems with a tyre (separation, bulge, etc ) or a rim (bent, out-of-round, etc). These problems are not cured with a balance.
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  #3  
Old 08-08-2017, 05:28 PM
Tracker56 Tracker56 is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by marwil99 View Post
My steering wheel vibrates at 110kmh, as if the wheels are out of balance. Have had balanced 3 times. Wheels also been aligned. 20" wheels and A/T tyres.
Checked bushes, steering, brakes also.
Does pull slightly to the right on braking, but no judder. Any other suggestions apart from changing the wheels and tyres ?
2014 right hand drive Ranger.

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Try swapping the wheels from the rear to the front and see if the vibration changes.
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  #4  
Old 08-08-2017, 07:15 PM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

Just because a shop changed you for wheel balancing 3 times does not mean they did it correctly even once.

Look at all four wheels and tires, check each one for the amount of wheel weights they used per wheel and let us know if they put weights on both sides of the wheeel or just one side.

As mentioned you could rotate the tires and see if the vibration moves to the seat.

Yet if all four are not balanced correctly that may be a waste of time.

For now take notes of how much weight is on each wheel and post your findings.

Many modern shops should have access to a Road force variation balancer.

These machines are helpful in aligning the heavy spot of the wheel opposite of the heavy spot of the tire.

It can also be used to let you know if your wheels are out of round excessively and same goes with the tires as mentioned by Cowboy.

My local Goodyear pissed me off with the last set of new tires I purchased for my wifes HHR we had.

I drove it home after the tires were installed only to have the car shake me to death.

I turned around and went back to the shop, I got out and looked at each wheel.

They had over three ounces of weight on each back wheel.

That was a red flag to me because my Wife's HHR never needed more than 3/4 to 11/4 ounces per wheel to get them balanced properly.

When I questioned them on it, they got all pissy and claimed I did not ask for a Road Force Variation balance.

Then they tried to say I had bent wheels.

Before they installed the new tires I told them flat out If I have bent rims let me know and I will buy new ones.

Not to mention I did ask for the Road Force variation balance and paid extra for it, I had proof on my receipt.

I had them re balance all four using the Road Force variation, after they re clocked the tires to the wheels the needed wheel weights were down to about 3/4 a ounce per wheel like normal.
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  #5  
Old 08-09-2017, 05:02 AM
marwil99 marwil99 is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

Thanks guys, some very useful feed back. They are brand new tyres. They only have weights on the back, and they are the stick on variety. I will check they weights and let you know. The shop also mentioned to me that the wheels might be to blame. They wheels have been fully rotated, back to front and side to side, but problem still exists by the same amount.
I am not sure what type of balance machine they used, and was not aware of the one you mention. Will check that too. Attached photo shows my wheel with the old tyres on. You can see where the weights are.


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  #6  
Old 08-09-2017, 05:48 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

With those type of wheels, shops can only offer a static balance, this means the wheel weights only go on one side.

Static balancing works for the most part but is not as good as a normal balance.

If it is determined that the wheels are to blame and you replace them, pick wheels that can have clip on weights installed on both sides of the wheels.

I have also found most tire shop technicians to be lazy or unwilling to do their best.

Meaning if your wheels have a lot of road grime, brake dust, old ahehesive from previous wheel weights stuck to the wheels this stuff should be cleaned off perfectly before new tires are installed and the assembly balanced.

Whenever I have new tires installed to old wheels, I like to take them off the vehicle remove the old weights and clean the wheels before I bring the vehicle in for new tires.

This also gives you a chance to spot obviously bent or damaged wheels that they do not care about until after you spent your money on mounting and balancing etc.

This will not help you at this point or at all. But lately when I need new tires I purchase tires and wheels from Tire Rack. This way I know I end up with properly balanced tires and wheels with zero scratches damage etc from the mounting and balance procedure.

I have not found one tire shop near me that is trained or capable of doing a better job than Tire Rack.

All Tire Rack offers is tires and wheels so it is safe to say they have it down to a science and care about the end result and appearance of your investment.

With all this being said I do not know for sure your wheels are the cause of your problem.

However with just the one picture you provided you can see at least three stacks of wheel weights with I am guessing well over 3 ounces of weights.

This is excessive If you want to prove if the wheels are causing the problem and not the tires, the only thing that could be done short of a Road Force variation balance, is to have the tires removed after you clean the wheels and old weights noting how much weight was on each wheel.

Then have the wheels checked on the balancer to see how much weight each wheel requires without the tires on the wheels.

A good wheel should require little to no weight to balance it.

The wheel should also be round and not egg shape when on the balancer.
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  #7  
Old 08-09-2017, 07:37 AM
cowboybilly9mile cowboybilly9mile is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

Quote:
Originally Posted by marwil99 View Post
Thanks guys, some very useful feed back. They are brand new tyres.


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New tyres and new wheels are never assured to be 100% free of defects.
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  #8  
Old 10-01-2017, 03:10 PM
marwil99 marwil99 is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboybilly9mile View Post
New tyres and new wheels are never assured to be 100% free of defects.


Guys, I got this issue sorted after back and forth to the dealer and tyres shops. Yes, shops. The first one , where I bought the tyres from had multiple attempts at balancing, and aligning, but could not get rid of the vibration.
Eventually my dealer took it to a Goodyear tyre shop, with a very experienced technician, who rebalanced just once, and got it right first time. No more wobble/vibration. One of the wheel weights did fall off on its maiden trip, but he fixed that the very next day.
Lesson is take your Ranger to a a good tyre shop with a caring, experienced technician, who has seen and fixed all sorts of wheel and tyre issues.
I reckon a combination of apprentices and poorly calibrated balance machine were to blame.


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  #9  
Old 10-02-2017, 03:31 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: Steering wheel wobble

You cannot expect a shop to do their job properly the first time so you have to set them up for success.

Before heading out to get new tires if you have old wheels, take off all four tires and wheels.

Clean the wheels perfectly front and back, make sure to remove any and all old wheel weights and get rid of any trace of the old adhesive with Goof Off cleaner.

There should be no dirt, grease, grime, weights, etc on the wheels when you are done cleaning.

Then once the wheels look and feel clean to the touch re mount the tires and wheels and head off to the tire shop.

Once you get your vehicle back from the tire shop, before you drive anywhere check each wheel for the weights they placed.

If you have the type of wheels that require only stick on weights on the inside of the wheel, consider a OEM type of wheel or Aftermarket wheel that uses clip on weights on both sides of the wheels.

Balancing a tire and wheel with clip on weights on both sides will yield the best result.

Static balancing a wheel is second best when the standard balance cannot be done, but if you have a aftermarket wheel or OEM wheel that has a inside lip for clip on weights insist the shop uses clip on weights.

One things people do not know about tire shops is they will use old or incorrect clip on wheel weights so when you go to the tire shop of your choice, do not ask just walk over to their tire balancer and look at their weights ( they should all be brand new )

If you see old clip on wheel weights mixed in with the a few new ones turn around and go somewhere else.

I like to have my wheels checked without tires to find out how much weight is called for to just balance the wheel and valve stem.

Then I use a sharpie to mark the weight amount on each wheel in a place that cannot been see like the back side of the face of the wheel.

After the tires and wheels are mounted and road force variation balanced I take note of the total amount of wheel weight that it took to balance them.

The total amount of weight used should not exceed the industry standard maximum of 1% of the tire and wheel assembly.

If the amount of weight is high just not over the industry standard one and your wheel is not bent you could have the tires shaved and re balanced.

If this helps yet it still calls for a lot of weight the last thing that can be done is to remove the weights and do a on the car balance where you have as many positions as you do lug nuts to try and off set the amount of weight needed by also balancing all the rotating parts.

However a on the car balance leaves you where you have to mark the position of each wheel before removal and every time you have to rotate the tires you have to have them balanced again.


If any lazy shop or technician gives you back your vehicle with new tires mounted and balanced and they still have the tire label or sticker still on the treads make them remove the stickers and balance the tires over because the weight of the sticker can cause them to be out of balance slightly once the sticker is worn away.

BTW clip on - hammer on weights work great, when they use the correct weight for the wheel and they install them properly.

It normally only takes a tap or two two get them mounted properly.

However many untrained mechanics keep pounding away on the weight until the weight gets bashed into the rim which spreads and weakens the clip.

So if you hear tap tap tap thud thud while they are doing your balance
they just ruined your wheel weight and balance.
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Last edited by EaOutlaw1969; 10-02-2017 at 03:41 AM.
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