|
|
|
|
11-28-2012, 10:54 PM
|
|
Ford lover
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 7,058
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spidey2011
There are no accidents when it comes to this stuff. Only negligence. Something had to have been done incorrectly. The teacher could have measured something wrong, or any number of things. It was the teachers responsibility to ensure the experiment was done in a safe manner. Obviously, they failed at that, and students were injured as a result. No excuse, IMO.
|
That is true. However we are human, we do make mistakes. Some mistakes are worse than others, this one just happened to be a pretty bad one.
__________________
2003 Ford Ranger FX4: 4.0L V6 | Auto | 4.10s | 265/75R16 BFG AT KO2 | Ion Alloy 174 | Pioneer radio | Alpine Speakers| 06 tails | Thunderbolt turn signal mirrors | Kobalt Toolbox | 22" LED lightbar | Blackout headlights | Headache Rack | 140K miles. DWB!
Build Thread <-- Clicky
March 2015 TOTM
2016 Ford Fusion SE. 1.5L EcoBoost. 6-speed Auto. White Platinum Tri-Coat Metallic. 18" 5 spoke black rims. Daily Driver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioMike
One can never have too many detailing supplies.
|
|
|
|
|
Register and never see these ads again. |
|
11-28-2012, 11:02 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03DJ
That is true. However we are human, we do make mistakes. Some mistakes are worse than others, this one just happened to be a pretty bad one.
|
True. Humans do make mistakes. However, I dont see any way that this COULDN'T have been prevented. Its like owning a firearm. You have a set of rules that you follow constantly. If by chance you "accidentally" break one rule, there are others that keep people from getting hurt.
As a teacher, this person was held to a higher standard than most. They were responsible for the safety of those children. Someone in that position should not make a "mistake" of that magnitude.
|
|
|
|
11-28-2012, 11:28 PM
|
|
Ford Ranger Driver
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,761
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
As a teacher, this person was held to a higher standard than most. They were responsible for the safety of those children. Someone in that position should not make a "mistake" of that magnitude
|
Of all the things to happen today especially in a school environment where kids are faced with drugs, weapons, and other violence, I think that this is a minor incident that possibly will get blown way out of proportion. There is absolutely no evidence to indicate that the teacher acted inappropriatel, therefore, the incident can only be defined as an accident and not a malicious deed. What should happen? The teacher should lose her job, get suspended, be sued. I'm sure that due to the nature of what happened, a thorough investigation will be in order. What if it is determined that the equipment or chemicals were tampered with? Should the teacher still face discipline? Where does it end? How many experiments occur each and every day in labs at all levels of education with no problem? Should we completely ban science? Have a second instructor/teacher's aid? I've always felt that the punishment should fit the crime, but in order for that to occur, there has to be a crime. What was the intent? A simple science experiment can go awry, which was the case, and unless other evidence surfaces to prove otherwise, I think that life should go on. Interview the teacher and students to make sure that preliminary cautions were taken and move forward.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-28-2012, 11:37 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthranger
Of all the things to happen today especially in a school environment where kids are faced with drugs, weapons, and other violence, I think that this is a minor incident that possibly will get blown way out of proportion. There is absolutely no evidence to indicate that the teacher acted inappropriatel, therefore, the incident can only be defined as an accident and not a malicious deed. What should happen? The teacher should lose her job, get suspended, be sued. I'm sure that due to the nature of what happened, a thorough investigation will be in order. What if it is determined that the equipment or chemicals were tampered with? Should the teacher still face discipline? Where does it end? How many experiments occur each and every day in labs at all levels of education with no problem? Should we completely ban science? Have a second instructor/teacher's aid? I've always felt that the punishment should fit the crime, but in order for that to occur, there has to be a crime. What was the intent? A simple science experiment can go awry, which was the case, and unless other evidence surfaces to prove otherwise, I think that life should go on. Interview the teacher and students to make sure that preliminary cautions were taken and move forward.
|
If in fact there was no negligence on the teachers part (i.e. Bad or tampered chemicals, then I would say there should be no disciplinary action. More likely though, the teacher messed up (mismeasured or something like that), at which point, I believe the teacher should be fired. Thats not a mistake that should be taken lightly. Kids were injured.
Ive never been one to subscribe to the "punish the many for the deeds of the few" attitude. Many classes do without these kinds of incidents every day, due in part to the vigilance of the instructors. Deal with the issues as they arise. This situation is an issue that needs to be dealt with.
Last edited by Spidey2011; 11-28-2012 at 11:40 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 11:28 AM
|
|
^thats what they call me^
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 533
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spidey2011
There are no accidents when it comes to this stuff. Only negligence. Something had to have been done incorrectly. The teacher could have measured something wrong, or any number of things. It was the teachers responsibility to ensure the experiment was done in a safe manner. Obviously, they failed at that, and students were injured as a result. No excuse, IMO.
|
yes that is true but think of a typical 8th grade douch with a little sense about chemicals. he or she probably went behind the teachers back and purposely stole or brought in some chemicals that were dangerous. it doesnt matter how much you stress safety an 8th grader wont listen or care...
__________________
1998 ranger extended cab, 2wd, 4.0 ohv, 5 speed, sony xploid 52 4 way watt radio, 2 pair of pioneer 240 watt speakers, Cobra 29 LX LCD CB radio pushing 100 watts , k&n air filter, 15 inch exploder wheels, dual exhaust with 4 inch stainless tips , 2 12 inch subs with a 1000 watt amp just for the hell of it!
new project: dirt track modified racing at the local saturday night track .
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 11:31 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowdpleazer
yes that is true but think of a typical 8th grade douch with a little sense about chemicals. he or she probably went behind the teachers back and purposely stole or brought in some chemicals that were dangerous. it doesnt matter how much you stress safety an 8th grader wont listen or care...
|
From the description, it was only the teacher doing the experiment. Not the kids. So the blame falls squarely on her shoulders, as far as Im concerned.
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 01:48 PM
|
N/A
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 9,031
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthranger
An eighth grade science lab experiment causes an explosion that sends five students to the hospital. None of the injuries seem very serious, and, of course, an investigation is continuing. Thankfully, the students are OK, but this brings up a thought. What if this weren't an accident and kids were purposely messing around with the chemicals? Will schools in the future ban laboratory science and chemistry classes? I am not trying to be silly, but with everything happening in the world today from weapons being brought to schools to students having hit lists, it seems that an innocent lab would be a perfect place to experiment w/o any suspicion. The link to the article is below:
http://news.msn.com/us/five-kids-inj...room-explosion
|
the way I see it is the US has yet to ban guns even after all the crimes with guns so banning labs because of some punks would be hypocritical.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 01:54 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rango88
the way I see it is the US has yet to ban guns even after all the crimes with guns so banning labs because of some punks would be hypocritical.
|
It's already illegal for criminals and the mentally ill to own guns. Why should it be illegal for the people that will only use them for lawful purposes? You Canadians and your gun control.
Like I pointed out earlier, the teacher was the only one doing the lab, not the kids. The teacher messed up. Deal with the problem, not the object of the problem. The problem is that a teacher failed to do her job. What happened as a result of that is irrelevant. Much like gun control, rather than blaming the person misusing the gun, people blame the gun. An inanimate object doesn't hurt anyone. Much like science class hurts no one.
Deal with the problem. A teacher messed up, and she should be punished. Due to the magnitude of the situation, I would say firing is a real possibility.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 01:58 PM
|
N/A
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 9,031
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spidey2011
It's already illegal for criminals and the mentally ill to own guns. Why should it be illegal for the people that will only use them for lawful purposes? You Canadians and your gun control.
Like I pointed out earlier, the teacher was the only one doing the lab, not the kids. The teacher messed up. Deal with the problem, not the object of the problem. The problem is that a teacher failed to do her job. What happened as a result of that is irrelevant. Much like gun control, rather than blaming the person misusing the gun, people blame the gun. An inanimate object doesn't hurt anyone. Much like science class hurts no one.
Deal with the problem. A teacher messed up, and she should be punished. Due to the magnitude of the situation, I would say firing is a real possibility.
|
that's like blaming a parent because her kid drew on the walls with crayon, its not always the teacher's fault. And I am not advocating Gun Control just that I doubt the US will abolish Labs in school because of one incident. Guns were used as an example.
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 02:05 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rango88
that's like blaming a parent because her kid drew on the walls with crayon, its not always the teacher's fault. And I am not advocating Gun Control just that I doubt the US will abolish Labs in school because of one incident. Guns were used as an example.
|
Not even a comparable example. Based on the info we currently have, the kids did NOTHING! It was all on the teacher. She did the lab, she screwed up, and she caused an explosion. Totally her fault.
At least read my posts. The teacher was the one doing the lab, and the kids were only watching.
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 03:21 PM
|
|
Ford Ranger Driver
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,761
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
the way I see it is the US has yet to ban guns even after all the crimes with guns so banning labs because of some punks would be hypocritical
|
How does a story about a science experiment explosion turn into a debate about guns?
Quote:
its not always the teacher's fault. And I am not advocating Gun Control just that I doubt the US will abolish Labs in school because of one incident. Guns were used as an example
|
I agree that the teacher doesn't appear to be at fault based on the information that was given. I also think that it is premature to abolish science labs based on one incident that went awry, and I only used that as an example because I partly disagreed with Mike's response that the teacher was solely responsible. How are situations supposed to be avoided in the future? I don't want to automatically dismiss anything that is why I stated earlier that reading a simple article doesn't answer all the questions a reader may have, for instance, why would a simple experiment go wrong? It has been brought up that teachers normally use very safe examples, and if everything were done correctly, we wouldn't be here discussing this topic. There are many possibilities, for instance the chemicals may have been tampered with or outdated. But, other possibilities exist also, such as the teacher not paying attention, defective equipment with the heat source, etc., and w/o knowing anymore info. I think that it is premature to suggest that the teacher should be solely responsible and possibly fired.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 03:29 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthranger
How does a story about a science experiment explosion turn into a debate about guns?
I agree that the teacher doesn't appear to be at fault based on the information that was given. I also think that it is premature to abolish science labs based on one incident that went awry, and I only used that as an example because I partly disagreed with Mike's response that the teacher was solely responsible. How are situations supposed to be avoided in the future? I don't want to automatically dismiss anything that is why I stated earlier that reading a simple article doesn't answer all the questions a reader may have, for instance, why would a simple experiment go wrong? It has been brought up that teachers normally use very safe examples, and if everything were done correctly, we wouldn't be here discussing this topic. There are many possibilities, for instance the chemicals may have been tampered with or outdated. But, other possibilities exist also, such as the teacher not paying attention, defective equipment with the heat source, etc., and w/o knowing anymore info. I think that it is premature to suggest that the teacher should be solely responsible and possibly fired.
|
I did qualify my statement. If it turns out that there was negligence on the part of the teacher (which is the most likely scenario at this point), then it is solely her responsibility. If by some chance there was a factor beyond her control (even outdated chemicals would still be negligence, IMO. That's something that should have been checked before hand. I'm talking about them being tampered with or mislabeled), then that is something entirely different.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 05:01 PM
|
|
Ford lover
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 7,058
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthranger
How does a story about a science experiment explosion turn into a debate about guns?
There are many possibilities, for instance the chemicals may have been tampered with or outdated. But, other possibilities exist also, such as the teacher not paying attention, defective equipment with the heat source, etc., and w/o knowing anymore info. I think that it is premature to suggest that the teacher should be solely responsible and possibly fired.
|
You know there are possibilities of old equipment being a factor as well. Lets say the teacher was using a beaker (most likely) and that that beaker just happened to have a hairline crack that isn't noticable, if she had strong acid in that beaker it may be fine but when you add another chemical in a reaction occurs and the heat radiating off the reaction could have caused the thing to explode. I know that that example wasn't very good but my point is that there is a lot of room for errors to occur, some are bigger than others this one just happened to be a big error on either the teacher, the materials used, or some kid thats up to no good.
__________________
2003 Ford Ranger FX4: 4.0L V6 | Auto | 4.10s | 265/75R16 BFG AT KO2 | Ion Alloy 174 | Pioneer radio | Alpine Speakers| 06 tails | Thunderbolt turn signal mirrors | Kobalt Toolbox | 22" LED lightbar | Blackout headlights | Headache Rack | 140K miles. DWB!
Build Thread <-- Clicky
March 2015 TOTM
2016 Ford Fusion SE. 1.5L EcoBoost. 6-speed Auto. White Platinum Tri-Coat Metallic. 18" 5 spoke black rims. Daily Driver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioMike
One can never have too many detailing supplies.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 05:09 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,958
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03DJ
You know there are possibilities of old equipment being a factor as well. Lets say the teacher was using a beaker (most likely) and that that beaker just happened to have a hairline crack that isn't noticable, if she had strong acid in that beaker it may be fine but when you add another chemical in a reaction occurs and the heat radiating off the reaction could have caused the thing to explode. I know that that example wasn't very good but my point is that there is a lot of room for errors to occur, some are bigger than others this one just happened to be a big error on either the teacher, the materials used, or some kid thats up to no good.
|
For 7(?) kids to have been injured, it would have to have been bidder than that. I suppose there's a possibility that it was an equipment failure, but everything should have been inspected before the lab. Most issues that could cause a small explosion would be found during a proper inspection.
Good theory, but again, very unlikely. The most likely cause of this was negligence. Plain and simple.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
11-29-2012, 05:25 PM
|
|
Ford Ranger Driver
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,761
|
|
Re: Science Class Explosion
Quote:
I did qualify my statement. If it turns out that there was negligence on the part of the teacher (which is the most likely scenario at this point), then it is solely her responsibility.
|
I value and respect your opinion, even if I disagree, and I would feel the same way if it were my child injured in class.
Quote:
You know there are possibilities of old equipment being a factor as well.
|
I couldn't have said it better myself, and that is the point that I was trying to make. There are a lot of explanable reasons that an accident occurred, and, of course, they all can't be listed. The main point is that the kids are OK.
Quote:
For 7(?) kids to have been injured, it would have to have been bidder than that. I suppose there's a possibility that it was an equipment failure, but everything should have been inspected before the lab. Most issues that could cause a small explosion would be found during a proper inspection
|
You may be surprised at what can cause an explosion, and a hairline crack can be so small that the naked eye cannot see it. Also, some of the kids were taken to the hospital "only as a precaution" because of smoke inhalation, and while I'm not going to understate that it isn't a big deal, I stand by the fact that until more information is known I still believe in an accident.
|
|
|
|
|
|