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  #46  
Old 11-24-2010, 08:47 AM
05RangerEdge 05RangerEdge is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coleosis View Post
How did your friend get a drivers license and insurance without being a citizen?
He didn't have one that's why he is in this situation.
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  #47  
Old 11-24-2010, 08:50 AM
azgilamonster azgilamonster is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by MooDib View Post
I'm not saying he shouldn't get an education because his parents brought him here illegally, I'm saying the government should have caught this and sent him back to his own country so he could get his education there.



You are exactly right, I have all these rights and freedoms, not him or his family. As harsh as that seems, that is the way things are. The entire world can't just become citizens of the US on a whim.



I know you referred to edgman, but since I have been just as vocal as him I will answer you. I have never been to Guatemala, however my brother is married to a half Guatemalan who was born and raised there and he has been to Guatemala as well. I've heard about their political system and their problems (she had been kidnapped three times I believe) but she apparently doesn't think it is so bad as to fear for her life and not visit. Not all places to live are ideal and if you want to change that work hard and apply for citizenship.

----------



Yes, you are the Democrat I fear. Not because you are a Democrat, but because you are uninformed and make baseless decisions that could ruin this country.
Uninformed, doubtful. open minded yes.
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  #48  
Old 11-24-2010, 08:51 AM
WearyTraveler WearyTraveler is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by MooDib View Post
I'm not saying he shouldn't get an education because his parents brought him here illegally, I'm saying the government should have caught this and sent him back to his own country so he could get his education there.
I agree with you. They should have caught on a lot sooner then now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MooDib View Post
You are exactly right, I have all these rights and freedoms, not him or his family. As harsh as that seems, that is the way things are. The entire world can't just become citizens of the US on a whim.
We have freedoms and yes people should not come to the country illegally, but there is nothing we can do if the get here. Once they are here they have rights. The Bill of Rights does not state only for citizens of the United States, does it? As soon as they are here they have those rights, illegal or not.

Why can't people become citizens on a whim? I know there is a process but why can't anyone decide to become a citizen? Are you saying that we should exclude people for coming here? I surely hope not.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MooDib View Post
I know you referred to edgman, but since I have been just as vocal as him I will answer you. I have never been to Guatemala, however my brother is married to a half Guatemalan who was born and raised there and he has been to Guatemala as well. I've heard about their political system and their problems (she had been kidnapped three times I believe) but she apparently doesn't think it is so bad as to fear for her life and not visit. Not all places to live are ideal and if you want to change that work hard and apply for citizenship.
Your sister-in-law is very brave. Being kidnapped once would keep me from going back but 3 times, she has balls of steel.
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  #49  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:02 AM
MooDib MooDib is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by vapiper View Post
The part that pisses me off about all of this immigration shit and people just wanting to be granted citizenship is the fact that I too have a friend that is an "alien" Now.....

She came to this country as an au-pair and while here decided she loved this country.....she worked, paid taxes, and was even a volunteer firefighter/emt....so....only in the country for a couple years and already doing MORE for the community than most that are "natural" citizens.

She meets another friend of mine...they end up getting married...He is in the Marines...well all the while they are paying thousands...yes you got that right...for filing, extensions to her visa, more legal filings, lawyers...

Well he ends up getting orders for Iraq.....and her visa will expire while he is on his 1 year tour....now what do you do?

THIS is what pisses me off...people who think they have a "story" and are more worthy of becoming a citizen of this great country, more than those that are attempting at doing it the correct way.

I say let happen what will happen...he can get in line with all the others attempting to gain citizenship. He has already benefited by getting a higher education than most in his native country. I'm sure he will find good employment, hell could run the country LOL

The good ending to my story is after a letter writing campaign to the governor and a few senators, her application was accepted and happily ever after....

But the balls of some people thinking they should just be "granted citizenship" pisses me off....There is the right way, and the wrong way to do something. We should not reward those that go about the wrong way....we should show and teach them the right way.

As for Guatemala, I'm sure he will be fine.....I've met plenty from that country, not as dire as some would have you think.

I do wish him good luck, and hopefully he can gain legal status here going about things in the proper way. And if this works out for him bravo....but no I don't feel bad or sorry for what it took for him to get legal, it SHOULD be a fight....it shouldn't be easy, it should mean something.

oh well, rant off LOL
There are some things to your story that don't add up for me, but you are right in that there are plenty of people who deserve to be citizens instead of someone who just wants to be one because he is here.

If your friend is married to a US citizen, she is automatically granted citizenship for the time that she is married. If she gets a divorce, no longer citizen. If her husband was foreign but is now in the marines, he is also granted citizenship for his service and, thus, so is she. As far as I know this is the way it should work out, and if it is not than it just reaffirms my belief that we need immigration reform.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by azgilamonster View Post
Uninformed, doubtful. open minded yes.
Open minded I doubt. To me it seems hard to stare at the face of logic and fact and then look the other way, but maybe that's just me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WearyTraveler View Post
We have freedoms and yes people should not come to the country illegally, but there is nothing we can do if the get here. Once they are here they have rights. The Bill of Rights does not state only for citizens of the United States, does it? As soon as they are here they have those rights, illegal or not.

Why can't people become citizens on a whim? I know there is a process but why can't anyone decide to become a citizen? Are you saying that we should exclude people for coming here? I surely hope not.
Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. If we let people come here on a whim half of Mexico, Guatemala, Columbia and many other countries would come running. I don't agree with our immigration standards now and I believe they should be less strict while allowing more people to immigrate every year, but if you let everyone in our economy would quite possibly collapse. You can't have a huge influx of people and somehow be able to sustain it. On a whim doesn't work for the economy.

As for the Bill of Rights, that does pertain to everyone even if they are here illegally. They should not be persecuted and they should be free to follow their religion, etc. However, the Bill of Rights makes no mention of education, healthcare, drivers license, social security, medicaid, welfare, etc. Treat people fair, but still treat them in accordance with the law.
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  #50  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:02 AM
Coleosis Coleosis is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by 05RangerEdge View Post
He didn't have one that's why he is in this situation.
Oh, well fuck him and his family too...I feel more pity for the AMERICAN that has to deal with being in an accident with an illegal uninsured driver. I hope they catch the rest of his family, and I hope whoever employed any of them go to prison and lose their business.
  #51  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:03 AM
ranger1444 ranger1444 is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Anyone read the part where the family applied for asylum but was denied a few years ago? Hmmm, so he knew something wasn't right.
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  #52  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:05 AM
edgeman4.0 edgeman4.0 is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coleosis View Post
Oh, well fuck him and his family too...I feel more pity for the AMERICAN that has to deal with being in an accident with an illegal uninsured driver. I hope they catch the rest of his family, and I hope whoever employed any of them go to prison and lose their business.
x2,000,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by ranger1444 View Post
Anyone read the part where the family applied for asylum but was denied a few years ago? Hmmm, so he knew something wasn't right.
Which is why his family is hiding like roaches when you turn the lights on.
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  #53  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:06 AM
dos0711 dos0711 is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Are you saying that we should exclude people for coming here? I surely hope not.

So we should let all the criminals that Fidel turned loose to come to America be allowed to be citizens? No thanks.

Teddy Roosevelt said it best...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theodore Roosevelt
We should insist that if the immigrant who comes here does in good faith become an American and assimilates himself to us he shall be treated on an exact equality with every one else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed or birth-place or origin.

But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American and nothing but an American. If he tries to keep segregated with men of his own origin and separated from the rest of America, then he isn't doing his part as an American. There can be no divided allegiance here. . . We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language, for we intend to see that the crucible turns our people out as Americans, of American nationality, and not as dwellers in a polyglot boarding-house; and we have room for but one soul loyalty, and that is loyalty to the American people.
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Last edited by dos0711; 11-24-2010 at 09:11 AM.
  #54  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:11 AM
brett20 brett20 is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Lmao hahaha edge you are racist/prejudice, plain and simple, if it's not your way then you don like it, maybe you should learn to keep your fucking mouth shut before you get it shut for you by someone
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  #55  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:14 AM
dos0711 dos0711 is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Pass the popcorn...this is getting good...
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  #56  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:29 AM
WearyTraveler WearyTraveler is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by MooDib View Post
Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. If we let people come here on a whim half of Mexico, Guatemala, Columbia and many other countries would come running. I don't agree with our immigration standards now and I believe they should be less strict while allowing more people to immigrate every year, but if you let everyone in our economy would quite possibly collapse. You can't have a huge influx of people and somehow be able to sustain it. On a whim doesn't work for the economy.

As for the Bill of Rights, that does pertain to everyone even if they are here illegally. They should not be persecuted and they should be free to follow their religion, etc. However, the Bill of Rights makes no mention of education, healthcare, drivers license, social security, medicaid, welfare, etc. Treat people fair, but still treat them in accordance with the law.
It may or may not hurt the economy. I do not know. That is something for the economists to work out.

I agree. But children do not have the option of choosing their parents, so keeping them from needed services is wrong.
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  #57  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:29 AM
FlyinRyan FlyinRyan is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

I have to say that if you are here illegaly and are caught, you should be deported.
This country has a process for gaining citizenship.

My grandparents are not native to the USA but they didn't just show up and live here.
They went throught the process of becoming a US citizen. It took time for them to get their citizenship, but they did it the right way.
They went to school, got a good education and got good jobs.
They pay their taxes unlike the millions of illegals.
They follow the laws unlike many illegals. They got their driver's licenses, and insured their vehicles instead of just driving without a license or insurance.

My point is that if you want to live in the USA then you should go through the process of becoming a citizen. If you are illegal then you have no right to be benifiting from tax payer's dollars, and example would be public education.
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  #58  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:31 AM
edgeman4.0 edgeman4.0 is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by brett20 View Post
Lmao hahaha edge you are racist/prejudice, plain and simple, if it's not your way then you don like it, maybe you should learn to keep your fucking mouth shut before you get it shut for you by someone
Where is your proof that i am? other than the fact that i A: pissed in your corn flakes about your 20" wheels. Or B: Dont like the fact that illegal immigrants are taking over MY country.

Do you have any proof beyond that? Bc it sounds to my like i'm a red-blooded american.

I especially like the last part of your little temper tantrum.. Are YOU going to be the one to "shut it for me"? You'd better pack a fucking lunch, while you're at it.. bail your illegal buddy out of jail, you'll need his help too. I hope the both of you can out run my friends SMITH & WESSON.
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Quote:
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Quote:
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  #59  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:39 AM
WearyTraveler WearyTraveler is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by dos0711 View Post
So we should let all the criminals that Fidel turned loose to come to America be allowed to be citizens? No thanks.
Criminals should never be allowed to become citizens but anyone else should have as much right as your ancestors did.

I do not agree with Teddy. He was a good man but his ideas are a little too ethnocentric for me. His quote is from 1907. A lot has changed in the USA since then.

Can I ask what nationality you are? And are you proud of your heritage?
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  #60  
Old 11-24-2010, 09:43 AM
MooDib MooDib is offline
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Default Re: Might lose a friend

Quote:
Originally Posted by dos0711 View Post
Teddy Roosevelt said it best...

[/B]
Ahhh, Teddy Roosevelt, perhaps the greatest President ever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brett20 View Post
Lmao hahaha edge you are racist/prejudice, plain and simple, if it's not your way then you don like it, maybe you should learn to keep your fucking mouth shut before you get it shut for you by someone
Wow, absolutely nothing he said was racist. Prejudice, maybe a little, but that's very hard to tell from a forum but that was a good use of vague threats in an online discussion. Congratulations, you're a winner!

Quote:
Originally Posted by WearyTraveler View Post
It may or may not hurt the economy. I do not know. That is something for the economists to work out.

I agree. But children do not have the option of choosing their parents, so keeping them from needed services is wrong.
So are you saying we should allow things to happen because you don't know what it will do? Do some research or take an economics course (macro would be best) and then get back to me on if something like this would hurt the economy. The short answer is "Yes, it would".

Needed services like what? Education is not needed to survive, a Ritalin prescription is not needed to survive, a drivers license is not needed to survive. What services are you talking about that are truly needed? Some people in this country have lived under such good conditions that they forget what is really needed and what is not. Most of the world population survives without healthcare, air conditioning, prescription medication, etc. Life isn't always great so be thankful with what you have and try to help others. Don't expect the government(s) to give handouts because people are too lazy.

This thought brings me to another question. How many of you who have supported his immigration into the state have donated time or money to a good cause? Kind of curious who talks it up but figures the government will back it up for them.
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