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  #16  
Old 09-05-2017, 10:43 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Most non essential circuits do not get power during cranking.

Before you spend any money on a code reader I would call the manufacturer of any scanner your considering.

most of the experience with scan tools I have are with industrial grade diagnostic tools like snap on, sun, bear etc. most of these tools are not affordable or sold to the General public directly but may get picked up second hand on eBay yet even old scan tools can be very expensive.

If your like me and do not want to hand the stealer a blank check for diagnostics I would spend some time calling around so we can at least get some basic diagnostic data.

The other option is finding a way to bypass the pats system entirely yet I do not have experience with doing that or know if it is possible on the 2002 ranger.

I know some cars anti theft system can be bypassed yet I also came up empty handed for the 2002 ranger.
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  #17  
Old 09-06-2017, 06:29 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

I spoke with Autel technical support department, you can purchase a reasonably priced tool to just read the Pats Codes.

They have the MD 802 and MD 808 but neither of those diagnostic tools will allow you to do the necessary test and procedures to fix your truck.

The only way to get the diagnostic and repair help and still do it yourself is to buy a entry level pro diagnostic tool like their Autel 906

Here is a link to the MD802 https://www.amazon.com/Autel-MD802-M...te+MD802&psc=1

Here is a link to the 906

https://www.amazon.com/Maxisys-Upgra...el+906+scanner

Other manufacturers may have similar type of tools but the pricing will also be similar.

It seems your choice is pay up to the dealer or pay up for the diagnostic tools or get lucky and find a way to bypass the Pats system.

Bypassing the pats system seems to be hit and miss with different years makes and models of vehicles I have not found any reliable data on the 2002 Ford Ranger.

One thing for sure that we do know is if your theft light is flashing you will have codes in the computer.

The tech seemed positive that your keys need to be reprogrammed yet I am not convinced that even if reprogramming gets your truck running again that it would be a permanent repair.
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  #18  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:31 AM
Fackler Rebel Fackler Rebel is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Sounds like you have a bad igniton switch.
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  #19  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:47 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

A bad ignition switch would not cause the theft light to flash.
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  #20  
Old 09-06-2017, 08:52 PM
kgo5xd kgo5xd is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Quote:
Originally Posted by EaOutlaw1969 View Post
I spoke with Autel technical support department, you can purchase a reasonably priced tool to just read the Pats Codes.



They have the MD 802 and MD 808 but neither of those diagnostic tools will allow you to do the necessary test and procedures to fix your truck.



The only way to get the diagnostic and repair help and still do it yourself is to buy a entry level pro diagnostic tool like their Autel 906



Here is a link to the MD802 https://www.amazon.com/Autel-MD802-M...te+MD802&psc=1



Here is a link to the 906



https://www.amazon.com/Maxisys-Upgra...el+906+scanner



Other manufacturers may have similar type of tools but the pricing will also be similar.



It seems your choice is pay up to the dealer or pay up for the diagnostic tools or get lucky and find a way to bypass the Pats system.



Bypassing the pats system seems to be hit and miss with different years makes and models of vehicles I have not found any reliable data on the 2002 Ford Ranger.



One thing for sure that we do know is if your theft light is flashing you will have codes in the computer.



The tech seemed positive that your keys need to be reprogrammed yet I am not convinced that even if reprogramming gets your truck running again that it would be a permanent repair.


Thanks for doing that. I appreciate you checking with them. The price for that second one made me poop my pants. I can't justify spending a grand on a tool that I won't use very much. Why does it need to be that to help me? Is it because it will reprogram if needed? I was really thinking more along the $200 amount if I were to get a new one.


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  #21  
Old 09-07-2017, 04:20 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgo5xd View Post
Thanks for doing that. I appreciate you checking with them. The price for that second one made me poop my pants. I can't justify spending a grand on a tool that I won't use very much. Why does it need to be that to help me? Is it because it will reprogram if needed? I was really thinking more along the $200 amount if I were to get a new one.


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There is a lot more involved when it comes to having built in diagnostic test and programming features compared to just capturing codes.

Honestly it sounds like you will have to visit the dealer which as you know may be very expensive.

This is where you will have to decide invest in the tools needed to do the job ( which you may get lucky and find a second hand diagnostic tool for much less money on eBay or craigslist).

Or just pay up and have it professionally repaired and hope it never causes you a problem again.

How long have you had your Aftermarket keys working with this truck?

I have read a few articles where a aftermarket key could loose its programming or send the wrong signal causing the Pats to time out and or wipe all the keys from the system.

If the problem happened originally while using a aftermarket key I would consider tossing them out or to the side and have your OEM Ford keys re programmed by a Locksmith.

I am not sure how much that would cost and I am not sure if it would fix your issue but if this was my truck that small cost and risk is what I would take before I considered going to any shop.

BTW why do you need 4 keys?
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  #22  
Old 09-07-2017, 06:09 AM
kgo5xd kgo5xd is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

The aftermarket keys have been working for over a year. We don't need 4 keys, I just wanted to have a all in one style key rather than the key and then the FOB separate. One of the FOBs loopy thing broke so I can't even attach it to a key ring. So my solution was aftermarket all in one. I programmed them using my two original and haven't had to use the original since. I only got them out when I was having this issue.

My original keys are stratum or whatever it's called. The ones with an S. I read somewhere on here that they can cause issues and fail. Is that true?


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  #23  
Old 09-07-2017, 06:24 AM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgo5xd View Post
The aftermarket keys have been working for over a year. We don't need 4 keys, I just wanted to have a all in one style key rather than the key and then the FOB separate. One of the FOBs loopy thing broke so I can't even attach it to a key ring. So my solution was aftermarket all in one. I programmed them using my two original and haven't had to use the original since. I only got them out when I was having this issue.

My original keys are stratum or whatever it's called. The ones with an S. I read somewhere on here that they can cause issues and fail. Is that true?


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I am not 100 Percent sure about any of this as I indicated, you may want to sign up to another forum I go to a lot and post this most likely pats problem there. RonD seem to know a lot about the Ranger and has impressed me many times.

https://www.ranger forums .com/
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  #24  
Old 09-09-2017, 07:00 PM
kgo5xd kgo5xd is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Quote:
Originally Posted by EaOutlaw1969 View Post
I am not 100 Percent sure about any of this as I indicated, you may want to sign up to another forum I go to a lot and post this most likely pats problem there. RonD seem to know a lot about the Ranger and has impressed me many times.

https://www.ranger forums .com/


That link doesn't work for me.

I checked my fuses and all seem good in the side panel in the cab. I checked all the similar sized ones in the PDB under the hood and those are good. I don't know how to test the larger ones though.

I cleaned the battery posts and replaced both terminal connectors and still no joy. The next free thing I can do is make sure the ground locations are clean and sanded down on the chassis.

My next question is if I were to invest in a pro diagnostic tool, would that be a definite way to know what's wrong and thus lead me to a way it fix it or could it just be a waste of money and I'd still have to go to a dealer to get it fixed or program my keys or something. Do the spendy diagnostic scanners program the keys too?


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  #25  
Old 09-10-2017, 01:59 PM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

the more expensive diagnostic tools can program the keys and should have some diagnostic test, yet keep in mind even this tool is expensive it is still a entry level tool and may leave you needing more diagnostic capabilities than you have or cause you to need other equipment to go with it.

look at the other ford ranger forum using google it is the first in the list when you search for ford ranger forum titled as the ultimate ford ranger resource
Hopefully RonD can help some
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  #26  
Old 09-10-2017, 11:57 PM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

I have been so tired from lack of sleep from my back and our storm, I forgot to mention what I like to do when I may have to repair something that I have not done before I look at Alldata and the list of possible codes that I may encounter.

Each code for the pats system has a pin point test if you read each pin point test and follow the flow chart as if your working on the problem to see where the flow chart takes you it will also let you know what if any other special tools you may need to do that specific pin point test.
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  #27  
Old 09-11-2017, 06:06 AM
CalebJ CalebJ is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

You can program the keys yourself using Forscan (free) and a good ELM327 interface ($30) to the OBD2 port.
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  #28  
Old 09-16-2017, 07:05 PM
kgo5xd kgo5xd is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

Quote:
Originally Posted by CalebJ View Post
You can program the keys yourself using Forscan (free) and a good ELM327 interface ($30) to the OBD2 port.


I ordered an elm327 interface to try out forscan. We will see if it picks up any codes.




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----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by EaOutlaw1969 View Post
I have been so tired from lack of sleep from my back and our storm, I forgot to mention what I like to do when I may have to repair something that I have not done before I look at Alldata and the list of possible codes that I may encounter.

Each code for the pats system has a pin point test if you read each pin point test and follow the flow chart as if your working on the problem to see where the flow chart takes you it will also let you know what if any other special tools you may need to do that specific pin point test.


What exactly do I need to perform a pinpoint test. Is it done with a multimeter?

I removed the pats transceiver today and checked the wiring. It looks fine. Not sure how to test it to see if it actually works though.

While I was under the steering column I noticed this wire that goes to the brake pedal was damaged. I think it just operates the brake lights they still worked though. Should I fix it anyway?



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  #29  
Old 09-17-2017, 02:06 PM
EaOutlaw1969 EaOutlaw1969 is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

As long as the wire is intact just tape it up.

As far a the pin point test, you would have to look up in alldata and start reading the different pin point test to see what you may be testing what tools you may need and any common easy to check things found in the pin point test may be commonly tested with many of the pin point test.

for example if each test wanted a battery test to insure proper voltage before starting any test I sure as hell would be testing the battery and connections.
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  #30  
Old 09-19-2017, 12:31 PM
kgo5xd kgo5xd is offline
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Default Re: No Crank No Start No Fun

I got the forscan to work on my pc with a Bluetooth obdII reader.



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