rough idle in 2008 2.3L automatic - Page 2

zolar1 · #16 03-01-2014, 11:04 AM

Ok, I cleaned my MAP sensor. It was dirty but not completely clogged.
There is a *noticeable* improvement.

The vibration is a lot less, but still there.

I do have cleaner in the gas (BG 44K) which may be causing some of it.

After cleaning, there was a LOT of vapor from the tailpipe. Not like when new but a whole lot more!
It is drinking gas like a thirsty camel though. Might be temporary due to ambient temperature (below 32F).

I will know more as time goes on. Computer might have to relearn - dunno yet.

But at least I made some progress.

I used CRC MAF sensor cleaner because it is 'plastic safe'.

Afraid to use the regular TB cleaner on a plastic manifold.

The sensor might be worn out but still functional.

That sensor takes a T25 to remove the screw.

zolar1 · #17 03-02-2014, 12:28 PM

Can you post a pic of where it is?? And what it looks like??i

Mine seems to be on top of the valve cover in the front (about #1 or #2 spark plug wire area) with a plastic tube going to the rubber intake tube about a foot before the TB.

It has a small white 'lever' to slide to unlock it.

zolar1 · #18 03-03-2014, 10:11 AM

Update: I plan on having an 'induction cleaning' to clean the grime out of my intake.

It costs about $125. It is supposed to not only clean the grime out of the intake but some of the valves, O2 sensor, and CAT.

It takes about 30 minutes to do.

If your MAP sensor is clogged then you might want to have that done too. Or it will just clog back up again.

zolar1 · #19 10-28-2015, 02:40 PM

I never did the induction cleaning.

I think the PCV valve is located right on top of the valve cover with a hose going into the hose that is between the air box and throttle body.

Looks like a beech to get off.

Still having BAD gas mileage when cold. Loud exhaust until it warms up all the way. Some vibration in the seat and floor when cold.

Been to several shops and got diagnoses of bad/weak/lazy O2 sensor, bad CHT sensor (I can't find it as the place everyone says I have it it is not there and no wires either), bad cam sensor, bad coil pack/wires/plugs, yadda yadda.

I do not want to spend a fortune on throwing parts at it due to guesswork.

And I will not pay for diagnostics just to have them say no codes, nothing wrong, give me $100 scenario.

When turning climate control from the left positions to floor for heat, the dang engine electric fan comes on (not floor and vent nor defrost settings - floor only).

I am thinking bad cht but there are no codes at all.

Can anyone give me some sound advice?

GSF1200S · #20 10-28-2015, 03:37 PM

The pcv valve is on the drivers side of the motor. Its behind a cover and is easiest to access with the drivers side wheel removed (and for 2001-2003 rangers the dirt guard separating the wheel well from the engine bay). Any of you guys with bad oil leaks should definitely replace it ASAP- a pcv thats stuck shut means any excess crankcase pressure must be vented... somewhere. Usually its the oil pan gasket, timing cover gasket, or valve cover gasket.

In terms of the rough idle, keep in mind the duratec in the Ranger doesnt have a balance shaft like the focus engines. That said, mine idles smooth as silk when the air conditioning is off. Since I have a manual, I dont have load on the engine at idle, so mine is smoother. With an automatic in drive- especially with the AC also on- I can imagine roughness would be present. It IS a 4 cylinder.

One person mentioned a tapping or clacking of some kind from under the truck- probably normal. The duratec is a noisy bastard, especially if its an 01-03 variant with the crappy IMRC system on it (assuming the intake manifold has 30k+ miles on it). The duratec has an issue where the tappets (items between the camshafts/valves which actuate the valves) are poorly designed and get loose- enter the noise. It doesnt hurt anything in terms of durability- as it is often said in the motorcycle world "tappy valves are happy valves." Loose valves might sap a horsepower or two, but tight valves can burn valves out... I would use a mechanics stethoscope or breaker bar against your ear to listen to the bottom and top end of the motor- as long as the bottom end has a nice rolling bearing sound, and the top end only has light tapping, its fine.

In terms of "induction cleaning," just no. Thats a $150 dollar waste. If you want the throttle body cleaned, do it yourself- its super easy. Get some throttle body cleaner, loosen the hose clamp holding the air intake to it, unbolt it from the intake manifold, disconnect the throttle cable, and disconnect the TPS. It takes maybe 10 minutes to get off.

craiginator · #21 10-28-2015, 04:58 PM

I had the induction cleaning on my 01 2.5 at about 128k and I noticed an improvement in power and smoother idling. My mpg's were not improved. But for me it was worth the cost.

tomw0 · #22 10-29-2015, 06:24 AM

zolar1 ... if you want to see what the engine is doing, buy a reader on Amazon or ebay that plugs into the OBD-II port. Some have WiFi, some have BlueRay, so you have to choose, some even have USB. If you have a laptop, you can download Forscan software, for Fords. Pick a reader that will work with Forscan.
*I* do not have it, but now have a laptop that will work with it, so might get one just to watch the show...
It will report all the PIDs you want, and show you what the fuel trims are, what the O2 sensors are seeing... and more. I do not know all it will do.
It will let YOU do the diagnosing that the 'mechanics' are doing for $100/hour. You can see the MAP perform as the throttle snap drops vacuum and then gets high vacuum.
Easily worth $20 ... I think.
tom

GSF1200S · #23 10-29-2015, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomw0

zolar1 ... if you want to see what the engine is doing, buy a reader on Amazon or ebay that plugs into the OBD-II port. Some have WiFi, some have BlueRay, so you have to choose, some even have USB. If you have a laptop, you can download Forscan software, for Fords. Pick a reader that will work with Forscan.
*I* do not have it, but now have a laptop that will work with it, so might get one just to watch the show...
It will report all the PIDs you want, and show you what the fuel trims are, what the O2 sensors are seeing... and more. I do not know all it will do.
It will let YOU do the diagnosing that the 'mechanics' are doing for $100/hour. You can see the MAP perform as the throttle snap drops vacuum and then gets high vacuum.
Easily worth $20 ... I think.
tom

Prolly autocorrect, but you mean bluetooth instead of blueray

Ill have to look up that software. I have an ultragauge which is great on the road but having software that can give more info would be nice for troubleshooting in the future.

zolar1 · #24 03-14-2016, 10:19 AM

*UPDATE*

I did replace the worn out spark plugs with NGK G-Power. A little improvement with that.

After a very frustrating time of it a friend and I were looking under the hood watching the engine shake.

He glanced over and saw 2 cracks in my ignition coil. Dunno how I missed that.

I removed the coil and saw the 2 cracks easily plus one burnt hole in the side of it near one of the coil wires (about 2 inches below where the wire connects).

I replace the igntion coil and went on a test drive. Things seem better. Not so much engine vibration, a bit more power, and the transmission shifts better.

Waiting for the computer to relearn (soft reset of sorts).

Scangauge II is showing about a 25% improvement in MPG (I think it is still off by 1/3 though).

Just need a muffler and water pump now.

Interesting that no shop could discover something like a bad coil (no CEL though). 3 years of driving it this way too.

Engine still has a slight miss but that might straighten out on it's own.

Won't know more till a cold morning (under 40F) comes along.

Still do not know why the MAP sensor keeps getting grimy.

This is a 2008 Rager XLT I4 with 58,000 miles on it.
It does not have an MIRC on it.

GSF1200S · #25 03-14-2016, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zolar1

*UPDATE*

I did replace the worn out spark plugs with NGK G-Power. A little improvement with that.

After a very frustrating time of it a friend and I were looking under the hood watching the engine shake.

He glanced over and saw 2 cracks in my ignition coil. Dunno how I missed that.

I removed the coil and saw the 2 cracks easily plus one burnt hole in the side of it near one of the coil wires (about 2 inches below where the wire connects).

I replace the igntion coil and went on a test drive. Things seem better. Not so much engine vibration, a bit more power, and the transmission shifts better.

Waiting for the computer to relearn (soft reset of sorts).

Scangauge II is showing about a 25% improvement in MPG (I think it is still off by 1/3 though).

Just need a muffler and water pump now.

Interesting that no shop could discover something like a bad coil (no CEL though). 3 years of driving it this way too.

Engine still has a slight miss but that might straighten out on it's own.

Won't know more till a cold morning (under 40F) comes along.

Still do not know why the MAP sensor keeps getting grimy.

This is a 2008 Rager XLT I4 with 58,000 miles on it.
It does not have an MIRC on it.

The map gets grimy because all engines have blowby and ford routed the pcv valve to dump into the intake right by the map sensor.

You can either clean the map every so often, route the pcv through a catch can, or ignore it. Fwiw mine seems plenty grimy even after cleaned, but obd2 indicates it reads perfect.

I have ~95k on my engine, it gets 30+mpg on the freeway, doesnt burn a drop of oil and hauled my motorcycle 650 miles @65mph returning 27mpg... Its annoying but the engine will be fine.

zolar1 · #26 08-31-2016, 12:47 PM

Update

Fuel pump now making a high pitched noise. Sometimes louder than others.

Taking it to the repair shop on 9/1/16 to have it replaced and new fuel filter as well.

Dang thing costs a small fortune for the part.

Reason:

I have the 111.5" wheelbase. The 125's pumps are 1/2 the price!

Still engine missing a lot. Sometimes lopes badly in the morning then straightens out after 5 seconds or so. Any idea on that one?

Been running ethanol free gas for past 6 weeks and adding B12 chemtool to it as well.

My EPA mpg is rated 18 city. I an getting 23.5 city with that mix and with the engine miss and bad fuel pump. Highway MPG no change (maybe slightly less MPG at 55 mph) If A/C on engine vibration/miss very noticeable. MPG drops to 18 mpg city.

I do smell raw fuel on startup in the mornings but that goes away after a minute or two. No apparent soot buildup on tailpipe.

I wonder what I would get if everything was fixed?

I did not notice a fuel rail return line either nor a fuel pressure regulator.

Does it even have those????

I also noticed that when the engine miss is at it's worst, A/C on, engine hot, in gear and waiting at stop light, the brake pedal goes nearly to the floor.

Truck only has 63K miles on it (it is also an automatic).

zolar1 · #27 09-01-2016, 02:31 PM

Another update - 3 days in a row and the parts house forgot to order then part sheesh.

Repair shop plans on removing the bed.

Also, I found a fuel pump for $99 but that one for full size ranger with 4.0

Mine as luck would have it is a whopping $400 for the pump

zolar1 · #28 09-02-2016, 10:43 AM

Ok I will plan on having a friend help me change fuel pump and filter.
Seems pretty easy - pull bed off and just do it.

GSF1200S · #29 09-11-2016, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zolar1

Ok I will plan on having a friend help me change fuel pump and filter.
Seems pretty easy - pull bed off and just do it.

Yes, piece of cake on your own. I will offer this advice if you have ANY problems with the fuel pump: order a complete Motorcraft assembly from Rock Auto. Its much cheaper than at a dealer, and many have had issues with non Motorcraft pumps.

As I said above though, I wouldnt worry about idle roughness. It makes sense that an engine with no balance shaft would transmit vibrations into the truck when under load. The ONLY reason the manuals dont have this issue is because they idle in Neutral.

zolar1 · #30 09-15-2016, 11:37 AM

I installed a Delphi fuel pump and Fram fuel filter.
Removed bed - not that hard.

Hard part is it took 3 of us to install the fuel pump - seems springs are a bit tight?

Noise gone! Hooray!

MPG climbed slightly.

Some road noise was caused by flat spots in the tires and underinflated a little.

Had tire shop rebalance, refill tires, rotate them side to side this time, and check alignment.

Wheel bearings slightly loose but not enough to be a problem (they are new not long ago.)

One shock slightly leaking and water pump damp but no drips.

About engine vibration - it NEVER had it when new.

FORD does have an exhaust damper kit that they can install and reprogram ECM if you want to fork out a lot of $$$. Shouldn't need it now because it didn't need it when new. That is just treating the symptoms not fixing the problem.

Vibration is far worse when idling hot, stopped at traffic light and A/C on.
Exhaust is loud sometimes and other time I can hear a backfire in the intake (not loud but enough to hear it).

In the mornings the engine lopes a lot for about 30 sec. Almost like hydrolock (injector leaking down?)

Sometimes the RPM's are quite low too (around 500) until I tap on the gas and it revs to normal high idle.

Could bad IAC cause any of this??? Vibration, loping, etc?

My MPG shot up sky high for that truck for some reason.
Supposed to get 18MPG city but I am getting between 23.8 and 25.5.
Of course I have been running non ethanol gas and B12 Chemtool in it for 7 tanks in a row.

Going to finish establishing my baseline MPG with new pump, tires fixed, and no additives but still keep the good as in it.

On my next fillup I will put in some techron and see if that helps.

I suspect a clogged/leaking injector. Dunno yet.

Oh to remove the bed, it has 6 T50 torx bolts and 3 (7mm I think) screws for the filler neck, and unplug one connector for tail lights and such.
No need to remove tail lights or anything else to remove bed.

The 2 front torx are longer then the 4 rear torx bolts too.

Spending far too much money trying to get this roadworthy.