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  #1  
Old 03-16-2010, 01:18 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

I have a 2000 3.0 Ford Ranger Flex Fuel truck. In the middle of last year, I ran E85 ethanol fuel and my CEL came on. Got the codes, read lean on banks 1 and 2. Took to my mechanic to have it checked for leaks, no leaks were found and PCV was good. Switched back to 87 octane, and the CEL did not come back on.

So, last week I decided to run E85 again. Been over a year running straight gas, no CEL, no codes PO171 and PO174. Got almost home, 20 miles or so, CEL comes on. I change two O2 sensors, clear codes, light comes back on. Take it to Advance Auto, same codes as before, PO171 and PO174, lean on banks 1 and 2. This only happens when I run E85!

Is it my Flex Fuel sensor? Anyone have any ideas as to why this happens only when I run E85. Again, I have a flex fuel truck.

Thanks,
Garo24
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  #2  
Old 03-16-2010, 01:50 PM
richarddhoward richarddhoward is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Have you cleaned your MAF sensor lately? That may help clean up the code. Also does the truck run funny when you are running E85? Also with the flex fuel on the Ranger what does the rating in your manual say for what concetration of Ethanol you can use? It might be different than what you are running.
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  #3  
Old 03-16-2010, 01:54 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

I haven't clean my MAF, thought that might be the issue, but then why only when running E85 and not 87 octane?

My manual states E85 is just fine. The believe the ethanol I purchased yesterday was around E70 because of the winter months in Ohio.

Truck runs fine, sounds fine running E85, but this morning it was hard starting and rough. After the second crank, started right up. I do believe that it has a mist, slight rough idol, but that has been ongoing with either E85 or 87 octane.
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  #4  
Old 03-16-2010, 02:08 PM
richarddhoward richarddhoward is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Quote:
Originally Posted by garo24 View Post
I haven't clean my MAF, thought that might be the issue, but then why only when running E85 and not 87 octane?

My manual states E85 is just fine. The believe the ethanol I purchased yesterday was around E70 because of the winter months in Ohio.

Truck runs fine, sounds fine running E85, but this morning it was hard starting and rough. After the second crank, started right up. I do believe that it has a mist, slight rough idol, but that has been ongoing with either E85 or 87 octane.
It's never a bad idea to clean your MAF, use MAF cleaner, it's a specific cleaner you can get at any parts store.

Ethanol has a higher octane rating then gas, so it is more resistant to burn. I don't really know how that could lean it out either, except that maybe in the process of switching over your sensor might not read that it's E85 or whatever blend you are running and lean out your mixture, when it should inject more. You might have your mechanic troubleshoot the flexfuel sensor to make sure that it is working properly.

Do you just run one tank of E85 through, then the CEL comes on, then switch back to normal gas? You might try running a couple tanks of E85 through and see if that clears up the CEL.
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97 Ranger - 4.0 V6 auto, 4wd, 31x10.5x15s Wild Country XTX Sport All Terrains, Warn locking hubs, Pioneer deck with iPod attachment, Snugtop Topper, K&N filter, scan gauge II, Hella 500 Lights, More parts coming, waiting for the paycheck to get bigger!

Truck built in loving memory of Norm Howard
Outcast Racing
PNW Crew!!!
Afterhours Clan!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaron_ariens View Post
I think Henry just shit himself
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radness View Post
Its kind of like that carnival game "Whack A Mole" but with guns! Haha
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  #5  
Old 03-16-2010, 04:43 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

This is my second continious tank and the CEL came back on after the codes were removed at Advanced Auto. I was hoping to not have to pay my mechanic any more $$.

What else could it be? I hate it when I can't figure something out!
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  #6  
Old 03-16-2010, 04:49 PM
richarddhoward richarddhoward is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Quote:
Originally Posted by garo24 View Post
This is my second continious tank and the CEL came back on after the codes were removed at Advanced Auto. I was hoping to not have to pay my mechanic any more $$.

What else could it be? I hate it when I can't figure something out!
Try running another tank without removing the code. What about your spark plugs? What are you running for those? Air filter? I don't know at the moment I'm kind of at a loss but I might as well ask around.
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97 Ranger - 4.0 V6 auto, 4wd, 31x10.5x15s Wild Country XTX Sport All Terrains, Warn locking hubs, Pioneer deck with iPod attachment, Snugtop Topper, K&N filter, scan gauge II, Hella 500 Lights, More parts coming, waiting for the paycheck to get bigger!

Truck built in loving memory of Norm Howard
Outcast Racing
PNW Crew!!!
Afterhours Clan!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaron_ariens View Post
I think Henry just shit himself
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radness View Post
Its kind of like that carnival game "Whack A Mole" but with guns! Haha
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  #7  
Old 03-16-2010, 04:53 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Changed spark plugs around 75000 - 78000 miles. Autolites and changed spark plug wires with Motorcraft OEM at the same time. FRAM air filter changed last summer.
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  #8  
Old 03-16-2010, 04:54 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Any ASE Certified Master mechanics or FORD mechanics on this board? Maybe one of them would have some idea.
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  #9  
Old 03-16-2010, 04:58 PM
richarddhoward richarddhoward is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Quote:
Originally Posted by garo24 View Post
Any ASE Certified Master mechanics or FORD mechanics on this board? Maybe one of them would have some idea.
I have a degree in Diesel lol How does your air filter look? A lean condition can be caused by your air filter being restricted, and I don't know but the air/fuel ratio with E85 may be different than with normal gas.
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97 Ranger - 4.0 V6 auto, 4wd, 31x10.5x15s Wild Country XTX Sport All Terrains, Warn locking hubs, Pioneer deck with iPod attachment, Snugtop Topper, K&N filter, scan gauge II, Hella 500 Lights, More parts coming, waiting for the paycheck to get bigger!

Truck built in loving memory of Norm Howard
Outcast Racing
PNW Crew!!!
Afterhours Clan!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaron_ariens View Post
I think Henry just shit himself
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radness View Post
Its kind of like that carnival game "Whack A Mole" but with guns! Haha
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  #10  
Old 03-16-2010, 08:58 PM
littleblue littleblue is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

From the Ford Service Information CD:
P0171 - System to Lean (Bank 1) The Adaptive Fuel Strategy continuously monitors fuel delivery hardware. The test fails when the adaptive fuel tables reach a rich calibrated limit. For lean and rich DTCs:
Fuel system
Excessive fuel pressure.
Leaking/contaminated fuel injectors.
Leaking fuel pressure regulator.
Low fuel pressure or running out of fuel.
Vapor recovery system.
Induction system:
Air leaks after the MAF.
Vacuum Leaks.
PCV system.
Improperly seated engine oil dipstick.
EGR system:
Leaking gasket.
Stuck EGR valve.
Leaking diaphragm or EVR.
Base Engine:
Oil overfill.
Cam timing.
Cylinder compression.
Exhaust leaks before or near the HO2Ss.

P0174 - System to Lean (Bank 2) The Adaptive Fuel Strategy continuously monitors the fuel delivery hardware. The test fails when the adaptive fuel tables reach a rich calibrated limit. See Possible Causes for DTC P0171.

The Flexible fuel sensor has a separate code for any problems:
P0176 - Flexible Fuel (FF) Sensor Circuit Malfunction The FF sensor input signal to PCM is continuously monitored. The test fails when the signal falls out of a maximum or minimum calibrated range. Open or short in FF sensor VPWR circuit
Open in battery ground to FF sensor circuit
Open in FF sensor signal circuit
Short to ground in FF sensor signal circuit
Fuel contamination
Short to VPWR in FF sensor battery ground circuit
Short to VPWR in FF sensor signal circuit
Fuel separation
Damaged FF sensor
Damaged PCM

Maybe this will help...
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  #11  
Old 03-23-2010, 09:26 PM
hotrodranger hotrodranger is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

dont know if u fixed ur problem yet but when u changed ur spark plugs did u change them because of the codes or did it occur after u changed the plugs also you said u used autolights did u by the cheapest set or did u go for the platinums it calls for the cheaper plugs might be ur problem if thats what u used
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  #12  
Old 03-23-2010, 09:46 PM
Vrod21 Vrod21 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

I know you had it checked for leaks but check to rubbed elbows on the PCV line. They have a record of cracking and causing those codes. Replace entire line with heater hose.
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  #13  
Old 03-30-2014, 09:38 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

Guys, I know this an old post, but I am still having the same issue. LSt time I took it to my mechanic, they changed the sparks plugs and said the only other thing it could be, was the Flex Fuel Sensor.

Since I didn't want to spend 600-700 bucks on that part, I have just been running regular gas. Thought I would try the E85 again, and bingo light came back on, same codes.

Is there an easy way to test my MAF sensor? Since the original post, I did clean the MAF but cleaning didn't make the codes go away.

Would Cam Syncho have anything do to with it if it needed replaced?

When this first occured, I did have it checked for vac leaks. Was told none was found. They changed sparks plugs because it was cheaper than replacing the FF sensor.

Any ideas. As I stated, PO171 and PO174 only occur when I run E85.

Although I can see that if the FF sensor is malfunctioning, it would not tell the PCM to that the fuel is different. Anyone have experience with this issue?
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  #14  
Old 03-30-2014, 09:50 PM
pearlkid9988 pearlkid9988 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

For the flex fuel only use motor craft plugs if you notice the originals had 2 different part numbers 1 for each bank they have since redesigned the plug so they are the same (after developing more flex fuel motors). Non motor craft plugs cause codes on even non flex 3.0s they are very picky. Also switching back and forth on the older flex fuels is not advised as the computer has to learn the fuel strategies each time it requires a lot more ethanol to produce the same power as gas therefore you get lower mileage among other things. The simplest test is to unplug the battery and let it sit 30 mins to clear PCM when you run it again it will relearn idle and fuel maps and most likely the codes will go away, I stopped running it because of that and since it was hard to get E85 around here its to much trouble when i have to switch back. I doubt that your flex sensor is the culprit as most pump gas has at least 10% ethanol now anyways it would cause issues on E85 or regular unleaded.
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  #15  
Old 03-30-2014, 09:57 PM
garo24 garo24 is offline
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Default Re: E85 and codes PO171 and PO174

I actually have the original plugs because I changed them myself before I took it to the mechanic. I wonder if putting them back in would fix the issue.
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