Ford Ranger Forum - Forums for Ford Ranger enthusiasts!

Go Back   Ford Ranger Forum - Forums for Ford Ranger enthusiasts! > > >
Forgot Password? Join Us!

Welcome to Ford Ranger Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread

  #1  
Old 06-15-2015, 08:26 PM
Regul8r Regul8r is offline
Ford Motor Company
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 140
Default '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

The 3.0 has EATEN VALVE SEATS TWICE in 10,000 miles!!

Rebuilt motor fresh out of the machine shop.
Drove it about 4,000 miles and popped a MISFIRE code in #3.
Checked everything out and had lower compression so the shop pulled the head.
The exhaust valve was receded into the seat.
He replaced the valve and the seat.
Another 6,000 miles and it is throwing misfire codes on the other side 4, 5 & 6.
Same thing lower compression, pull the head and the same issue, BRAND NEW valve seats are JUNK!
When the #3 was replaced he confirmed he replaced it with the correct hardened seat.
When he pulled the driver side head he decided to pull the passenger head again too.
#3 with the confirmed and newly replaced valve and seat was bad AGAIN!!!

Ran ALL the tests he could find, watched the inputs and outputs of all the electronics.
NOTHING showed up!
Found some literature about the 04-06 heads had issues from the factory.
Does not look like that bulletin applies here as the bulletin is about the head is soft and the seat pushes back in to the head over time.

For BRAND NEW and properly hardened seats to be WORN OUT and destroying valves with in 3,000-10,000 miles is ridiculous!

ALL NEW during the build
Cam Synch, O2 sensors, fuel injectors, fuel filter, Computer, Wires, Plugs and Air Filter.
When the misfire code first showed up I replaced the coil pack with a motorcraft.

So now it is all back together, NO CODES, NOTHING out of the ordinary showing on the readers in live time.

ANY IDEAS!?
__________________
Carl Corey, www.grantorinosport.org forum moderator and annual show coordinator
1976 Ford Elite "Lola Mae", Gran Torinos- 72 Formalroof "Ol'Brown"4 additional parts cars (2x72, 1x73 Formalroofs) and a 72 GTS
90 T-Bird SC, 3.8l SUPERCHARGED, 97 Suzuki Intruder 1400
01 Ranger Ext cab, 2wd, 3.0(flexfuel?)/Auto
US Army Retired('12)
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-15-2015, 09:29 PM
GLH GLH is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,818
Default

You must be doing it wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-16-2015, 09:00 PM
Regul8r Regul8r is offline
Ford Motor Company
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 140
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

AND... the peanut gallery chimes in! SERIOUSLY!? WTF!?
__________________
Carl Corey, www.grantorinosport.org forum moderator and annual show coordinator
1976 Ford Elite "Lola Mae", Gran Torinos- 72 Formalroof "Ol'Brown"4 additional parts cars (2x72, 1x73 Formalroofs) and a 72 GTS
90 T-Bird SC, 3.8l SUPERCHARGED, 97 Suzuki Intruder 1400
01 Ranger Ext cab, 2wd, 3.0(flexfuel?)/Auto
US Army Retired('12)
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-16-2015, 10:19 PM
GLH GLH is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,818
Default

Yes, seriously. You are evidently doing something wrong when you repeat the same failure.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-17-2015, 08:49 PM
Regul8r Regul8r is offline
Ford Motor Company
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 140
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

We KNOW something is wrong!
It is NOT the seats, NOT the heads, NOT the valves!

THAT is why I am asking for anyone who has experienced it and what they found out!

Have read NUMEROUS posts after searching for HOURS on here for info that said these motors had a common issue of the exhaust valves.
Well, Hello! If this is a common issue then
WHAT IS THE ISSUE AND WHAT IS THE FIX?

How hard is that to understand and then have you NOT chime in with some bullshit statement tell me and my machine shop that we are doing something wrong... take your smartassery and post it on someone else's posts.


Now back to my original thread...
the 3.0 has exhaust valve issues as I have read and now experiencing myself.
WHAT was/is the problem and the fix??
__________________
Carl Corey, www.grantorinosport.org forum moderator and annual show coordinator
1976 Ford Elite "Lola Mae", Gran Torinos- 72 Formalroof "Ol'Brown"4 additional parts cars (2x72, 1x73 Formalroofs) and a 72 GTS
90 T-Bird SC, 3.8l SUPERCHARGED, 97 Suzuki Intruder 1400
01 Ranger Ext cab, 2wd, 3.0(flexfuel?)/Auto
US Army Retired('12)
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-17-2015, 09:50 PM
GLH GLH is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,818
Default

You can probably take the truck to a good mechanic who knows these engines and how to repair it properly.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-18-2015, 06:03 PM
rangerlocal rangerlocal is offline
Ermahgerd Ferd Rernjurs!
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,941
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

You don't say anything about replacing the heads. If this is a rebuilt engine (crate), maybe the heads that came on it were junk. If it has BEEN rebuilt, then again, maybe the heads are the problem.

Maybe you should just replace the heads and have the new heads, new seats, and valves in one package. For what you've dumped into these replacing their seats, you could have done that from the start.

And we're aware you're frustrated with the truck, but don't get all butthurt. This is the internet; have a thick skin if you want help.
__________________
2000 Ranger XL, 2WD, 3.0l, 3.73 rear, 10" rear drum ABS, standard cab, long bed, A/C, 4r44e auto trans w/transgo shift kit, throttle cable mod, air box silencer mod, rear sway bar retrofit, white grill swap, CURT hitch, Westin step bars
Quote:
Originally Posted by writtenaudio View Post
Man wish i had tits, seems like its easier to get a job if you have tits.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-18-2015, 07:50 PM
Regul8r Regul8r is offline
Ford Motor Company
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 140
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

Quote:
Originally Posted by rangerlocal View Post
You don't say anything about replacing the heads. If this is a rebuilt engine (crate), maybe the heads that came on it were junk. If it has BEEN rebuilt, then again, maybe the heads are the problem.

Maybe you should just replace the heads and have the new heads, new seats, and valves in one package. For what you've dumped into these replacing their seats, you could have done that from the start.

And we're aware you're frustrated with the truck, but don't get all butthurt. This is the internet; have a thick skin if you want help.
The engine was rebuilt by my local machine shop. Not new heads, not a crate motor. The seats themselves have not recessed into the heads. The exhaust valves seats are being burned out. I was asking here on the RANGER WEBSITE and looking for help from the experts.
Just like with my SuperCoupe ask the website and the experts there have ALL the answers and willing to help with anything they can.
Same for the Gran Torino site that I am the Moderator for. WE KNOW the 72-79 Cars inside out and help with the CORRECT info that even the local dealers and mechanics have no clue of!
So I asked here, IF NO ONE here knows what the issue is, what to check, verify a reading, common problems etc with this issue I am having then I will just take it for what it is.

As for butthurt... nope not me! I just get tired of seeing every post from certain people having the same attitude towards things. NOT the first time on my threads the SAME person has presented the SAME attitude! IF you don't have something to contribute to a thread or nothing nice to say... just resist the desire to be a smart ass.
My machine shop, a couple other local mechanics and I all KNOW what we are doing! The motor is rebuilt properly not done under the shade tree in the back yard! We have run it through ALL the scanners and verified all the numbers are right and readings are good. I currently have a MAC Tools data logger on it that the shop will read and see IF we find any weird glitches? Any weird issues we should pay extra attention to??
But we cannot know everything so IF NO ONE has a solution besides buy a new set of heads and HOPE that fixes it... I guess oh well, no one here can help.
__________________
Carl Corey, www.grantorinosport.org forum moderator and annual show coordinator
1976 Ford Elite "Lola Mae", Gran Torinos- 72 Formalroof "Ol'Brown"4 additional parts cars (2x72, 1x73 Formalroofs) and a 72 GTS
90 T-Bird SC, 3.8l SUPERCHARGED, 97 Suzuki Intruder 1400
01 Ranger Ext cab, 2wd, 3.0(flexfuel?)/Auto
US Army Retired('12)
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-19-2015, 03:38 AM
GLH GLH is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,818
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GLH View Post
You can probably take the truck to a good mechanic who knows these engines and how to repair it properly.
This is good advice.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-19-2015, 03:53 AM
MdubG MdubG is offline
Here we go again!
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,094
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Regul8r View Post

The engine was rebuilt by my local machine shop. Not new heads, not a crate motor. The seats themselves have not recessed into the heads. The exhaust valves seats are being burned out. I was asking here on the RANGER WEBSITE and looking for help from the experts.
Just like with my SuperCoupe ask the website and the experts there have ALL the answers and willing to help with anything they can.
Same for the Gran Torino site that I am the Moderator for. WE KNOW the 72-79 Cars inside out and help with the CORRECT info that even the local dealers and mechanics have no clue of!
So I asked here, IF NO ONE here knows what the issue is, what to check, verify a reading, common problems etc with this issue I am having then I will just take it for what it is.

As for butthurt... nope not me! I just get tired of seeing every post from certain people having the same attitude towards things. NOT the first time on my threads the SAME person has presented the SAME attitude! IF you don't have something to contribute to a thread or nothing nice to say... just resist the desire to be a smart ass.
My machine shop, a couple other local mechanics and I all KNOW what we are doing! The motor is rebuilt properly not done under the shade tree in the back yard! We have run it through ALL the scanners and verified all the numbers are right and readings are good. I currently have a MAC Tools data logger on it that the shop will read and see IF we find any weird glitches? Any weird issues we should pay extra attention to??
But we cannot know everything so IF NO ONE has a solution besides buy a new set of heads and HOPE that fixes it... I guess oh well, no one here can help.
Take your truck to another mechanic. If you keep going back to the same guy it's likely the true problem will never be found. I have an 03 3.0 vulcan engine and the only problem i've had are minor radiator system problems. Took it to my cousin twice and it still isn't fixed and i won't be going back to him for it again cuz it seems like he can't find the problem. Doing the same thing over and over will produce the same result. Go to another mechanic and more than likely you will find the true problem
__________________
2003 Red Danger Ranger extended cab
3.0L V6 2WD w/ Overdrive
Pioneer Radio
Sound Ordinance Amp
Diamond Audio 10" Sub
Air Box Mod
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-19-2015, 05:37 AM
GLH GLH is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,818
Default

Any chance there is an exhaust leak where the exhaust manifold mates to the head ?
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-19-2015, 09:45 AM
rangerlocal rangerlocal is offline
Ermahgerd Ferd Rernjurs!
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,941
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Regul8r View Post
The engine was rebuilt by my local machine shop. Not new heads, not a crate motor. The seats themselves have not recessed into the heads. The exhaust valves seats are being burned out. I was asking here on the RANGER WEBSITE and looking for help from the experts.
Just like with my SuperCoupe ask the website and the experts there have ALL the answers and willing to help with anything they can.
Same for the Gran Torino site that I am the Moderator for. WE KNOW the 72-79 Cars inside out and help with the CORRECT info that even the local dealers and mechanics have no clue of!
So I asked here, IF NO ONE here knows what the issue is, what to check, verify a reading, common problems etc with this issue I am having then I will just take it for what it is.

As for butthurt... nope not me! I just get tired of seeing every post from certain people having the same attitude towards things. NOT the first time on my threads the SAME person has presented the SAME attitude! IF you don't have something to contribute to a thread or nothing nice to say... just resist the desire to be a smart ass.
My machine shop, a couple other local mechanics and I all KNOW what we are doing! The motor is rebuilt properly not done under the shade tree in the back yard! We have run it through ALL the scanners and verified all the numbers are right and readings are good. I currently have a MAC Tools data logger on it that the shop will read and see IF we find any weird glitches? Any weird issues we should pay extra attention to??
But we cannot know everything so IF NO ONE has a solution besides buy a new set of heads and HOPE that fixes it... I guess oh well, no one here can help.
Well, considering what you're describing to me, if the valve seat isn't defective, there's no way to really eat "valve seats". Either the seat recesses into the head, or the valve burns due to bad sealing at the valve seat. What happens is exhaust gases pass between the imperfect seal of the valve on the seat, and the valve will burn, not the seat. Or, the seat retreats into the head and the same happens. You can't really "burn" a valve seat and they shouldn't get chewed away, as they are hardened.

So, since they are hardened, if they are properly constructed and installed, they should be fine. Anything engine related, to the heads or valves, would cause seat recession or valve burnage; hints, the problem is with the valve seats themselves. Either they are defective, both times, or improperly installed. Period. Now, if the valve had receded further into the seat, and the seat was reground and the valve shimmed, then a new seat was put in and the shims were not removed (aka, improper installation), the valve will pound through that new seat. So if this work was done originally when they were "replaced" (aka, reground then valve shimmed and lapped), and the shims weren't removed, this could happen. The seats and valves will also need to be carefully lapped together for proper mating.
__________________
2000 Ranger XL, 2WD, 3.0l, 3.73 rear, 10" rear drum ABS, standard cab, long bed, A/C, 4r44e auto trans w/transgo shift kit, throttle cable mod, air box silencer mod, rear sway bar retrofit, white grill swap, CURT hitch, Westin step bars
Quote:
Originally Posted by writtenaudio View Post
Man wish i had tits, seems like its easier to get a job if you have tits.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-19-2015, 12:30 PM
tomboy tomboy is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,728
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

My 2000 3.0 had a cracked head when I bought it, got another head from another 2000 with 79xxx miles. Took both heads to the machine shop and was told this by him. He said in 98 ford quit putting removable seats in the heads, the heads are soft, and the seats don't hold up. On the head I bought with 79xxx miles, the exhaust seats were already too wide. He said the only way to fix the heads was to put in removable seats.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-19-2015, 08:15 PM
Regul8r Regul8r is offline
Ford Motor Company
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 140
Default Re: '01 3.0 eating valve seats and valves? HELP!

this is what they looked like originally when I bought the truck and we took it apart for the rebuild.

The burnt piston was on the passenger side bank, NOT #3.

The pic of the valve is the one that came out of #4 and a close up of the head from #4 cylinder.

With this being the original problem as to why I had to rebuild it. It tells me SOMETHING has been wrong with it for a LONG time to do that to a piston and multiple valves all from different cylinders.
This is why I spared no expense and replaced EVERYTHING!
Cam Synchro, Coil Pack, Wires, Plugs, Injectors, Computer, Upstream O2 sensors, even had a custom ground cam to get a little more ooomph out of it and put the headers on to replace the manifolds and cats because the front Y-Pipe cats were loose and bad internally. With all the issues IN the cylinders that metal had to go somewhere and you could see deposits in the cats as well.
I also removed the air box silencer when I replaced the air filter as suggested here too.

The 4th and 5th Cats along with the downstream O2 are what was on the truck but it is not kicking any O2 sensor/cat codes. We ensured to keep the cat in front of the downstream O2 sensor to ensure it read properly.

The MAF is what was on it when I bought it too.

The only other thing that was jumped is the small coolant line from the heater hose "T" to the throttle body. Have never had a problem and is encouraged on numerous other Fords that use that set up.
The original plastic T's blew on the road 1,000 miles after the first rebuild.

The motor does not run hot, heats up and stays normal.
I have got anywhere from 8-17MPG on my trips but I was also hauling a 12ft trailer filled with parts, 1,000lbs maybe?

On the scanner nothing seems to be reading out of tolerance or showing any hints as to any computer controlled reason that would cause a something to over heat, lean condition or otherwise.

The rear being a 3.73 gear has the motor running in the high RPM range down the highway at 75-80 mph.

That is ALL the info on the motor and the build.

THANKS for the input to this point.
I REALLY hope we can find the issue!
IF any of the info above helps point someone to a KNOWN problem with the motor, feel free to repost your ideas!

Looks like time to take it up to the dealer and have them run it on the machines and see IF something is out of whack.

Pic #1 you can see the good seal surface of the intake valve and there is a MAJOR issue with the exhaust seat or lack of seat! you can see there is NO SEAT! So when we say it EATS VALVE SEATS... There you go! WHERE DID THE VALVE SEAT GO??
Pic #2 is the driver side bank, you can see 3 of the 4 exhaust valve seats are NOT seated/sealing, the 4th seat you can see there was a good seal on the valve seat.
Pic #3 is the valve from Pic #1 (Cylinder #4)
Pic #4 is the passenger side head
Pic #5 is the #2 Cylinder piston, you can see the burnt metal all over the head in Pic #4
Attached Images
File Type: jpg KIMG0582.jpg (68.3 KB, 21 views)
File Type: jpg KIMG0581.jpg (71.7 KB, 19 views)
File Type: jpg KIMG0586.jpg (45.2 KB, 20 views)
File Type: jpg KIMG0579.jpg (75.6 KB, 18 views)
File Type: jpg KIMG0580.jpg (54.7 KB, 18 views)
__________________
Carl Corey, www.grantorinosport.org forum moderator and annual show coordinator
1976 Ford Elite "Lola Mae", Gran Torinos- 72 Formalroof "Ol'Brown"4 additional parts cars (2x72, 1x73 Formalroofs) and a 72 GTS
90 T-Bird SC, 3.8l SUPERCHARGED, 97 Suzuki Intruder 1400
01 Ranger Ext cab, 2wd, 3.0(flexfuel?)/Auto
US Army Retired('12)

Last edited by Regul8r; 06-19-2015 at 08:28 PM. Reason: Labeled and described the pics.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-19-2015, 08:21 PM
GLH GLH is offline
Ford Ranger Driver
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,818
Default

Might have too much exhaust flow because of the headers and taking out exhaust components and/or an exhaust leak up high and/or poor mating at the header-head mounting.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What are you eating right now? Stewart Laugh Factory 1276 09-08-2017 05:58 PM
Eating computers - getting expensive Sub74 2.9 Liter Tech 21 10-30-2012 07:20 AM
so my 94 2.3l has been eating oil for a whille now.. nocauserebelx 4-Cylinder Tech 0 11-29-2011 10:29 AM
so my 94 2.3l has been eating oil for a whille now.. nocauserebelx 4-Cylinder Tech 0 11-29-2011 10:19 AM
eating this Article up! Ford FTW dixie_boysles Off Topic 8 10-05-2010 07:36 AM